Green Room - Week 31 - Day 5

[clauderainsrm.livejournal.com]

One of the things that I’ve tried this season, that I’ve done before – is “having a life” during Idol. Some of it is circumstantial, and some of it has been, having been burned by it in the past, trying my best to prioritize life.

Which means that I miss things here and there that I would have jumped on before. Actually, I think in the big picture, this has been good. Because it allows people time to work things out on their own, which is (apparently) a highly controversial stance of mine is some parts of the internet. Letting adults work out their own problems with each other – that’s something you don’t see very often. Especially from someone who is viewed as a control freak by some of the same people! ;)

I just think most people have the sense to deal with each other one on one and hash things out. When they don’t, well then I have to step in and be babysitter – usually making everyone unhappy in the process!

It’s because of these things – but mostly because of Tropical Storm Debby which has had my direct attention for the past few days – that I totally missed the discussion in the Work Room.

Most of it, I’m going to gloss over. Some people said things. Other people said other things. People disagreed. That’s fine. Seriously – whatever. Anyone upset about any of it should never, ever, ever read a Yahoo comments section. Consider this your trigger warning! Just don’t do it. You’re going to be upset.

There were a few things that I saw that, little comments, that made me want to respond. I’m going to avoid the “Conservatives and Christians” part, because they aren’t the same thing, never have been the same thing, and never should be the same thing. Two very different things that are sometimes combined. But really it’s a case of “Left Handed Baseball Players”. Sometimes they are both. But one doesn’t equal the other….

(Well, I didn’t avoid that as much as I planned on. But that’s a whole ‘nother spiel!)

The comment that caught my attention was directed at Idol. I’m sure it was meant as “the community as a whole” – and more specifically “this group of people who have gathered for Season 8 and who are still around at this point”. But that’s not what was said. The “competition” was addressed. And as the “Voice of the Competition”, I thought it was worth a response.

The line in question was “Why is this competition so set to protect the deaf and blind, but not someone whose disability is mental? That's what trigger warnings are for, to let those who have mental or emotional reactions know in advance that they might have a reaction”

There have been conversations about trigger warnings in the past. The decision to use them, or not, is entirely in the hands of the person who owns the journal. Some people like the use them. Some don’t. I’m not going to police – LJ IDOL – is not going to police for stating opinions and/or writing about things without covering someone who could potentially be triggered.

We’re just not.

If we were, we’d start with the things that sicken and repulse me. Things that never fail to get a negative, and sometimes stomach churning reaction due to my own personal trauma(s) over the years.

People have had entries and comments about them. Pretty much every season at least one of them has come up. I make a mental note to be a little more careful when I come across that person’s entries in the future. But I still read them, and judge them according to how much I liked the entry itself, while trying to put that personal feeling(s) to the side. (The fact that I vote for everyone means that even when I am personally affected by it, I still vote for that entry. There have been times, over the seasons, when that has been more difficult than others…)

The part of the comment that really got to me though was the implication that IDOL “protects the deaf and blind”.

I can guarantee you – the ONLY group that Idol has ever “protected” have been our “underage” participants, and even then I haven’t had to take action due to their parent’s involvement in keeping them from seeing certain things, and no one deciding to be an asshat toward them.

When our first blind contestant showed up, back in Season 2, my concern was making sure that everything was accessible to her. Once I talked to some people, some tweaks were made and the recommendations on putting alt tags on pictures were added to the FAQ. But that was it. Then I proceeded to beat her like the hippie she is! ;)

I can’t recall a single thing that Idol has ever done to “protect” the deaf from anything. I haven’t even had to adjust anything for them. I guess people adding transcripts to their audio files would help them. But that hasn’t been Idol, that’s been people being thoughtful and decent.

I take exception to the idea of Idol “protecting” a group (or in this case, groups) of people.

Maybe there are some “deaf and blind” people who need some sort of protection in Idol. But I haven’t met them. I imagine those would be “Left Handed Baseball Players”, people who just happen to be both, rather than one being related to the other.

If I do run into them though, I will see what they need, and figure out how to adjust something from a technical standpoint of making sure it’s accessible.

If I run into anyone else who has something else going on, where there’s an accessibility issue, I’ll see what I can do to help them out. Not to “protect” them from anything, or anybody – but rather because I want them to enjoy themselves and be treated like the dirty, smelly, damn foreigner, hippies that they are! ;)

***
Oh, and btw – there’s a vote going on! http://therealljidol.livejournal.com/580582.html

Comments

[n3m3sis42.livejournal.com]

Hmmmm. Someone beat me to it. Just wanted to say that if anyone has a problem with things I said in the Work Room the other day, please feel free to email me so we can talk about it? My intent was never to be hurtful or attack anyone. I feel like I've been misunderstood.

I'm having a really shit couple of weeks to be honest, so this on top of it all just sucks.

Email is n3m3sis42(at)gmail(dot)com.


Edit: Oh, and also FRIST!

[ellakite.livejournal.com]

YOU'RE *DEAD* TO ME!

(please enjoy the cookie.)

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

I'm finished reading so I'll head over to the home game tonight :)

[n3m3sis42.livejournal.com]

I think I'm going to go read the Home Game in just a few! kathrynrose mentioned something about her post to me and it sounded interesting. :)

[roina-arwen.livejournal.com]

I think the only things that need protection around here are cookies! Sentient folks can take care of themselves - if they werent able to, they wouldn't have an LJ account to begin with.

That's my .02 cents. You're welcome.

[clauderainsrm.livejournal.com]

Cookies do not need protection. They belong to me.

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

Trigger warnings: I try to use them when I think I could be triggering. I sometimes forget, but if asked, I will include one. I understand what it's like to be triggered (and even with a warning, I read anyway but that's probably not always the smart thing. My issues are more triggered by other things outside idol though). I can see why drugs, rape, molestation, self-harm and eating disorders (among other things) can trigger someone. Those are scary things to deal with and bringing back memories for someone trying to deal can be hard. So personally, I will try to put up warnings when I can.

But when it's just something that makes you uncomfortable or a viewpoint someone may not agree with? I won't do it. That's NOT the same thing a living through a traumatic experience such as being raped. Yes, one might be sensitive, but stop reading when something bothers you. Though I keep tea party people on my FB even though they bother me daily. Why? I learn from reading views that I may not agree with. I might see the world a bit differently. At the very least, it either makes me question what I feel inside evough to decide if I still think my views are right or change them if I decide they aren't. I'm a forever adapting human being. At one time, I considered myself a pro-life Republican. That's not a joke. Then I went to Libertarian. I'm not as liberal as they come (call me a socialist, I dare ya :P). The only way I've grown is by constantly questioning my beliefs and feeling uncomfortable at times while doing so. Because change is uncomfortable.

As far as accomadating anyone, Idol is an equal-opportunity enterprise when it comes to torture. And I prefer that you let the community police itself, Gary. That's how the real world works. Some people have filters, some people don't. Some will accomadate your sensitives, others won't. That's life. And allowing people to come forward and discuss these differences allows us all to learn from the experience more so than if you told us to walk on eggshells and made rules against things which might make people uncomfortable.

And just so it's clear, I may not agree with the opinions that were stated in the Work Room, but I'm all for a healthy discussion and I really don't think less of anyone for it. I'm a bit grumpy today and grrrr at people, my filter may be off. If I tell you I don't agree with what you're saying, it doesn't mean I hate you or I'm attacking you. Just a warning since I'm in a mood today. Rawr.

I have more to say (don't I always?) but I'm on my phone and autocorrect has already had its fun with several words. I'm sure I missed a few and if I have? Feel free to have a laugh at my expense to lighten up the comments in the GR. I'm sure it's gonna get pretty deep...

[similiesslip.livejournal.com]

::hugs:: I hope your day improves somehow.

[kathrynrose.livejournal.com]

Something happen in the work room?

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

*grins*

[noodledays.livejournal.com]

props to you, Gary - this was all very well said imo.

[cacophonesque.livejournal.com]

The thing is: Idol doesn't require anyone to use alt-tags or do any kind of accessibility stuff as participants. If you don't want to do it, you don't have to. But, if you're not doing it, then you'll be missing out on a chunk of potential audience, because there are people involved who will not be able to fully engage with your material without you making some accommodations. A lot of people decide that the inconvenience of an alt-tag is worth reaching more people.

There are a number of folks in the Idol community who advocate trigger warnings on posts. Like accessibility stuff, participants choose whether they want to do so or not. Those who don't do it risk upsetting or alienating potential audience. On the other hand, most literature in the world comes with minimal trigger warnings at best. If incest is a key revelation or plot point, the dust jacket probably isn't going to tell you about it. That's how the world works. The problem I've discovered on LJ is that most people want the world to adapt to their emotional needs rather than learning how to adapt to the world. I believe in sensitivity and being kind to others, but frankly having witnessed some discussions around these parts, I wonder how these folks function outside of LJ. I imagine they never read new books, never go to the movies, never put on the tv, and never go anywhere in public where they might see or hear other people. The only warnings I fully advocate are the ones that the mainstream media generally uses for graphic violence, sex, or gore.

This stance means that there's a possibility of losing some of my potential audience.

Although, in general people would probably be more sympathetic to the trigger warnings argument if most of the world wasn't constantly appropriating the phrase to mean "I find this vaguely upsetting and would prefer not to read about it" rather than "I have PTSD (or other psychological disorder) and exposure to this could send me into an episode". But that's an argument for another day.

[kathrynrose.livejournal.com]

Well said. Thanks for stating it so clearly.

[ashgaelsonaria.livejournal.com]

I tag when its warented. No one should have to read about the nightmares of my past who don't want to. But writting some things down helps even when I distance myself from them by writting in th third person. It is easier for me to write about some things like that.
It is hard enough when the nightmares come without reading something that sets them off.
that said I do not spend a lot of time in the work room and do not get into those discussions.
A.

[whipchick.livejournal.com]

Hey! I made the New York Times today :)

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/26/business/a-passengers-circus-props-delight-airport-security.html?_r=1&ref=todayspaper

[kathrynrose.livejournal.com]

Very cool!

I wanted to tell the guy that the ceiling is way too low on a plane to crack a whip.

You realize you just dashed the fantasies of mile-high-clubbers across the skies. :P

[m-malcontent.livejournal.com]

This may earn me my long awaited exit from this contest.

I don't like to use trigger warnings in my writing. I know that sounds really insensitive, but here is my thinking.

It is an internet convention that isn't present anywhere else in the world of writing. When I pick up a copy of Beloved, Toni Morrison doesn't tell me on page 1. Oh, by the way....there is a graphic violation and an infanticide...happy reading.

I would NEVER want to further traumatize anyone who has been traumatized. But, by the same token, writers gotta write....and we can't always write about Little Bunny Foo-Foo hopping through the forest and even then(TRIGGER WARNING LBFF gets WHACKED on the head).

Also I have trouble imagining ANY topic with enough dramatic tension to be worth an idol entry that wouldn't be traumatic and possibly triggering for someone. Any kind of family issue...any kind of violence...any kind of drug or alcohol use.....any kind of eating....etc...etc.

O.k guys, flame on...I am deeply sorry to offend, but I just feel like in the top 25 of a writing contest people who are voting should be able to read everything or decline to participate.

[cacophonesque.livejournal.com]

No flame war from me. This is pretty much my stance. Books rarely carry warning labels--you pick it up and give it a go. The idea of seeing a trigger warning on a novel or memoir seems a little absurd (beyond the occasional warnings for graphic violence or sex that pop up). And I can understand why a writer wouldn't want such a thing. It can detract from the overall piece or put all of the emphasis on a single scene. On the other hand, I doubt that most writers would refuse to publish in Braille or audio books if given the opportunity.

[theun4givables.livejournal.com]

Gary, I always appreciate it when you address things that get a little out of hand on idol. You make some excellent points.

I use trigger warnings on lj, and that's about it. They become almost second nature to me. But if someone doesn't want to use them, it doesn't bother me any. It Takes a lot to disturb me, after all.

[kathrynrose.livejournal.com]

Could someone explain the logic behind LJ sending me a comment notification that only says I'm not authorized to view the comment. I don't even know what thread it's from.

Curiosity, and me being part cat!

[alien-infinity.livejournal.com]

I am going to talk about something COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT and say how I may be making a new friend, maybe. If my social skills will come out of hibernation long to actually maintain the connection.

[xo-kizzy-xo.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't say that's completely irrelevant -- that's exciting, actually :)

Completely Irrelevant, Part 2

[xo-kizzy-xo.livejournal.com]

I would love nothing better than to put this dinosaur of a laptop to UTTER DEATH as quickly as possible. Which method would be better?

A) The Infamous Super Kizzy Flame Thrower™
B) Just tossing it out the window and letting it be run over by a passing vehicle
C) Vent all my frustrations by stomping all over it, with a good Gary-ish kick for good measure ;)

I no longer have a working backspace key. Words either jumble together or jump out of alignment. It's taken me 10 minutes to carefully type this.

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
I have no
backst

Re: Completely Irrelevant, Part 2

[kathrynrose.livejournal.com]

maybe get an external keyboard until you can replace it?


If not, the flame thrower sounds lovely.

::hands kizzy a beverage::

[theafaye.livejournal.com]

I just want to give kathrynrose's Home Game entry a shout out. It's excellent and should be read by everyone.

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

Yes. I second this!

[marjory.livejournal.com]

I want a trigger warning for stupidity.

I realise that this means I'm going to have to put trigger warnings on everything I've ever posted, including this.

But seriously, trigger warnings for rape, incest, self-harm, ED, violence and animal cruelty are both common sense and good manners, not least because reading about such matters can and does hurt people. See also NSFW warnings.

[clauderainsrm.livejournal.com]

I received an email from the person who made the comment. It was a very nice email, and very much appreciated.
The bottom line: They misspoke.

The idea they wanted to express was that Idol gives a great deal of consideration toward deaf and blind people by making things accessible to them.

Which does bring up an interesting point (a few of them actually, but I’ll aim at one):

When dealing with emotional and mental disabilities/issues/triggers/whatever the proper terms are: where is the line of consideration? Is there an accessibility issue there that *can* be addressed, or is that on the individuals involved?

Long ago, a Mormon friend of mine asked me to stop swearing in emails when I talked to him. At first – my gut instinct was to tell him F-YOU! I did it anyway, because he asked, and he was polite about his request. But that’s conversation, and a bit part of conversation at that.

What happens when it involves content?

In world that has become more and more polarized and partisan, is there a line where being decent and human toward each other extends – that doesn’t interfere on the actual points being made? OR is there a responsibility that is owned by each individual, to be in charge of their own “baggage”?

[cacophonesque.livejournal.com]

On the one hand, I try to be kind and respectful to people. I try to limit my profanity when I'm not talking with my immediate circle of friends. I attempt to be inclusive and I apologize when I say something racist. I do my best not to kick someone in the shins.

On the other hand, I've been working really hard on learning that I am not responsible for the emotional states of others. This is an important lesson for me, because I have a long history of holding myself accountable for other peoples' feelings. However, the only feelings I have power over are my own. I've got a history of sexual assault and grew up around substance abuse. There are days that I read things online or see things in films or whatnot that can put me in a pretty rough place mentally/emotionally. But, I guess that I don't blame the world for how I react to content.

So, I don't know. I really think that there needs to be a balance between "don't be an asshole" and "the world doesn't revolve around your issues".

[kittymichaels.livejournal.com]

Protect your puny human contestants all you want, Gary. There is no protection from me. No hiding. No running. They will all wake up one day with a hairball in their shoe. Not even my advanced age and failing health will slow me down. This I swear by all that is chicken.

[xo-kizzy-xo.livejournal.com]

Kitty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How are you feeling?

We've missed you!

:offers chicken:

[ashgaelsonaria.livejournal.com]

Dang this is a bother.
I think things like rape, sadism, e and xt should have a warning lable and while that may not be on page one of it book it IS usually there if you read the sinopsis on the back of the book. I have seen it a lot of times thank you very much.
It is there at the beginning of movies and TV shows.
As this has been reiterated in a number of comments I am just posting it once instead of over and over again.

Those of you who claim that trigger warnings do not exsist for books and other media are quit wrong they are not called trigger warnings but just plain warnings. They are their for Parents as well as adults. Anyone who takes the time to read the back of books should have incountered them before.
Also, anyone with common sense reading the backs of books with out a warning that should have one can oftain tell.

[rattsu.livejournal.com]

I am not sure if I ever posted warnings for anything but nsfw. -ponders- But luckily this whole debate was past before I even heard about it.