Work Room - Week 15/SC 2

[clauderainsrm.livejournal.com]

Consider your audience. Who is it that you are hoping read whatever it is that you have to say? What is this "ideal audience" of yours? Don't say "everybody" because you know realistically that's not going to happen. No author is universally loved.

Or hated for that matter.

Who are you trying to reach, and are you prepared if your actual audience, the people who really seem to enjoy your work, aren't the people you thought they would be?

It's kind of like setting up a restaurant in a hip, up-and-coming neighborhood only to be discovered by broke college students. How do you adapt what you are doing? Do you?

The new topic, for the main competition, is up: http://therealljidol.livejournal.com/531583.html
***

I also have a completely different question, sent in by someone who didn't want to post it themselves, for obvious reasons. ;)

"What do you think about alt journals deliberately revealing themselves (or deliberately not doing so) to anyone at any point during the game? If you intersected or beta-read with someone would you want to know that they were an alt, and would you want to know who they were? How would you feel if you found out later that they'd kept their identity from you? Would this answer change depending on the nature of your relationship with that person? "

Considering that this has come up in Idol in previous seasons before, with mixed results, it's certainly interesting to test the pulse of this particular group, since every season and combination of people are going to come to a different conclusion!

Comments

[kathrynrose.livejournal.com]

I was posting under an alt until this week, and I'll confess, I felt weird about it. I told a couple of people about it, but there were people who read my main LJ and comment regularly whom I did not tell.

I "came out" and posted confessions in both journals this week and there's been no big response. Honestly, I don't think anyone cared, or they did and haven't said so.

As it is, I thought it would be a big issue and as with most things, the conflict was all in my head.

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

I played under an alt during SCI last season while my main journal was in the main game. I outted myself to my close friend (and obviously my boyfriend) because I felt bad after engaging in conversation with her as an alt. I wondered how people would respond... I sacrificed the alt during a gatekeeper week and apparently that last entry was controversial. A couple people (some didn't know who it was) thought I shouldn't admit to who I was.

But I did. And people were surprised. There was no drama. I had a blast :)

I just stopped conversing with people outside comments on that journal after I felt bad for deceiving my friend!

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

I choose my audience based on what I'm writing I guess. Though generally, I assume I'm writing to other writers who are already familiar with what the topic is. So I try not to spend too much time defining what the topic means. I assume they know and if not, they can google it. I feel it's better to give them the benefit of the doubt and not say too much in that regard.

I also don't write to that audience. I prefer reading entries that didn't state the topic and that "this is the topic this week and...". Again, we understand what you're doing. Less is more. Keep it to help you get started if need be, but delete it later.

I wouldn't be too hurt to find out someone was an alt. Even if I did work with them. I find the whole idea of an alt as fun, not deception. I'd love to have had one myself this season, but no time. That being said, if it were my boyfriend or my bestest friend (if I had one), I'd love to be let in on the secret! But it's not that big of a deal to me (unless it was my boyfriend...then he better tell me :P)

[sneakishfrog.livejournal.com]

I totally agree -- the intro to the Idol topic and all that makes it a little tedious. Kind of like the "if you have to explain a joke..." idea. Though -- I know that other Idolers understand that the entry is supposed to fit a prompt; sometimes I wonder if my LJ friends are aware of why I might be writing about fossilized poop and have the urge to explain.

I generally like writing that trusts its readers - so, it's definitely up to them to google what they don't know!

[zalad.livejournal.com]

I'm going out of my way to not tell anyone who I am, except for my friend who is also taking part. I'm sure anyone with too much time on their hands could figure me out, but I'm not interested in the drama that could occur. Just here for fun. :)

If anyone felt betrayed or something, I'd tell them to find a new hobby. Like writing. ;)

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it doesn't bother me too much. I always like trying to guess... But I never try too hard. I like when they do a surprise announcement at the end do I can go "Wow! I never knew!"

Though I could see why people might want to keep it completely under wraps too.

[comedychick.livejournal.com]

Seeing as I had two alts in Second Chance last season, I figure I should weigh in. Let's see how much I can type from my phone (currently sitting in the lobby area of my hotel in Honolulu because my computer won't connect).

I felt bad having alts and my friends not knowing, so one of them I outed to my flist about a week into second chance. The other one I never made an official public outing, and it never made it into the main game anyway.

Personally I find it's more deceiving when an alt account acts like they're someone else, and commenting everywhere, without saying they're an alt. But I'd probably be more bothered by this behaviour if it was someone I was good friends with, interacting with me, without telling me who they are. If it's someone I don't know as well, it probably wouldn't bother me as much.

[pixiebelle.livejournal.com]

That's about how I feel too. I have very few people I'd be terribly upset about deceiving me, but if someone purposefully went out of their way to deceive me without identifying as an alt, and they were someone I was really close to... It might bother me a bit more than if it wasn't someone I was terribly close to.

[xo-kizzy-xo.livejournal.com]

I'm of two thoughts about alts. On the one hand, having an alt can be supremely useful if you're experimenting with a style that doesn't jibe with what your readers already "know" you for. On the other, there's a line there between having the alt purely as a writing exercise vs. an alt that becomes a whole other personality, especially if the alt's owner is someone who's been around for awhile: Do you keep posting in the GR under your main account or the alt's? How do you maintain the alt without giving yourself away?

[muchtooarrogant.livejournal.com]

I had every intention of playing under an Alt as well as in the main competition, but just didn't have the time. (Yes, jem0000000, I acted all confident and said it was child's play, and died a quick and mostly, aside from what little pride I have left, painless death anyway.) I'm actually glad it happened, because a couple of people from my Friends List also decided to join SCI, and I didn't feel right competing against them twice, if that makes any sort of sense. So, all's well that ends well I guess, although the Alt thing could've been loads of fun.

I say, if someone wants to play under an Alt, more power to them! If they gots the time, let 'em commit the crime! *grin*

At least now I can stop obsessing over which LJ User ID I'm logged in under before I start typing. LOL

Dan

[comedychick.livejournal.com]

LOL, when I alted multiple accounts, I just had different browsers for each login ;)

[sonophax.livejournal.com]

I think an alt could be fun, though I think I would probably let my close friends know it was me within a few entries, with the speed of said revelation depending on how much it seemed like it had a bearing on things.

As for my audience, I don't think I have a very clearly defined idea of who I want to write for - my thoughts on the matter usually consist of what I think people don't want to see from me, like, keeping repetitiveness in my themes to a minimum and trying to avoid recounting depressing memories... which isn't to say that I think other people should avoid the same things, just this is what I imagine "my" audience wants/doesn't want. xD

[n3m3sis42.livejournal.com]

I don't have a clear idea of who I want to write for. I know I don't want to only write for other parents, necessarily, which is why I try to post about things other than being a mom. I'm only moderately successful at this because mom stuff is on my mind a lot.

[kickthehobbit.livejournal.com]

...the thing that I've stated, time and time again, both in my own journal and in the various writing workshops I have participated in, regarding audience, is that I only consider audience when I'm writing a scientific paper (like the papers I coauthored with my old boss, where the stuff we were dealing with was new enough that a lot of explanation needed to be include, because otherwise our audience wouldn't "get" it).

I write for myself. My journal is kept for my own benefit, as are my Twitter and Blogger accounts. I write because I like to write, not because there's someone out there I'm trying to "reach"—I keep my journal as a record of who I am on any given day. I try to make it interesting mostly because, as I read back through it, the really dull, "omg today was so awful" entries are, well, boring to read back through, and anyway they don't make a lot of sense once I'm no longer in that context, and they don't provide a good feeling for where I was or what I was doing.

I'm participating in LJ Idol mostly because I was hoping it would help me to keep updating LJ on a regular basis despite being a full-time graduate student (teaching and taking classes 40 hours per week, sometimes more—the last week or so it's been more like sixty). It really has done that. Writing on some of the topics has reminded me of points in my life that I've grown out of, and it's provided an opportunity for some reflection I hadn't really indulged in yet.

I don't consider my audience because I am my audience. I stay true to who and what I am, and I write for myself, not for anyone else. This week, I realized that doing that means that I'm probably not going to last in the competition as long as I'd like, but when I weighed that against the thought of writing more "Idol-friendly" entries, I felt sick to my stomach.

This is who I am. This is what I know how to do. I'm not trying to "reach" anyone. I'm grateful for the attention that my work gets, and I'm pleased with a couple of the entries that I've put forward so far. That's...kind of it.

If I reach people, I reach people. If I alienate people, I alienate people. I feel a little strange, having gotten this far essentially going, "but I'm writing for me!", but...yeah. While I did not necessarily feel entirely that way at the beginning (see: worrying about votes &etc), as the competition has gone on that particular feeling has clarified: I am writing for myself as a record of where I am and how I feel about these particular topics at this particular time.

This is what I can do, it is what I want to do, and it is what I have been pleased by doing. I'm happy with what I produced and I'm looking forward to putting something else out there this week—because, if nothing else, a year or three from now I'll read what I've written and hopefully be happy with the quality of the writing and the topic I was writing on.

[jem0000000.livejournal.com]

*hugs* I think keeping a record is a lovely idea. :)

[jem0000000.livejournal.com]

People who want to read it. :)

Um? I would find it a bit disturbing if people were following my work just to say they didn't want to read it. I wouldn't know how to respond. I mean, what do you say? "Thank you, I'm glad you disliked it"?

Huh. If people like what you're doing, then adapting it would be counter-productive. On the other hand, writing needs a certain amount of change to grow.

***

If it's someone I avoid elsewhere, I wouldn't want to run into their alt here. But it stands to reason that if I'm avoiding them elsewhere, they're going to do the same things here, and I will end up avoiding the alt too, which is fine. (Can a bot have an alt, though? Seems that's most of the "people" I ban from my journal -- bots with links to a plethora of questionable "great product!"s.)

Other than that, it's not a big deal for me. I know people with "real" journals and "writing" journals, so it seems a bit normal to me for people to have more than one username. It's like offline people having a nickname and a real name (sorta; there's no body-switching involved, but they can certainly act like different people). Offline, I no longer use a nickname, and online, I don't currently use an alt (although I do have a nickname); but some people do, and that's okay. People have the right to self-identify, even if who they self-identify as in one place or at one time is not the person they self-identify as elsewhere or elsewhen.

That said, it changes if the idea is to deliberately deceive someone in a harmful manner. But that's a harm-done concept, and the problem there is not that they're identifying as a different username, but that they're causing harm. The username is just a tool, like a shovel or a knife.

By extension, as long as revealing or not revealing the main identity of their alt isn't harming anyone, it is completely and totally their right to reveal or not reveal, as they choose.

ETA: It is, IMO, "doing harm" to deliberately deceive someone you are aware would not want to be deceived. (Provided, of course, that this is not a safety issue where one needs to be someone else for one's protection.)

[jem0000000.livejournal.com]

Okay. So "people who want to read it" is almost as vague as "everyone".

I think part of the problem here is that I automatically change what I'm doing based on what I think other people want, so really, I'm adapting so much that it's hard to say when I'm not changing. So the reason I'm not seeing things like audience and adaptation is because I'm handling them on a level that doesn't require conscious decision-making.

That said, perhaps I'd write better if I made these choices deliberately.

So: audience.

Most likely? People who are medium-to-well educated, like words (to borrow from Whipchick here), like reading, like narratives (because nearly everything I do is a narrative), and are willing to be a bit patient with my lack of getting immediately to the point as long as I manage to wander in a creative manner (some weeks, I do. Other weeks, I edit). Also, in the case of my friends' list, people who are willing to put with my frantic requests for feedback. ;)

I don't know how much of my audience is based on who I am. I know that the narratives I write are spun from my own non-fiction narrative, filtered through my perceptions and desires and fears and prejudices and loves and yes, through what I think will get votes. For that reason, I do seek betaing and/or feedback on everything I write, typically from someone that I trust.

And I know that the people I seek to surround myself with online are other writers, especially people whose work I admire, and other people who share my interests, especially if they happen to be writers too. So that, too, is part of my intended audience.

But really, honestly, I'll take anyone who can click a checkbox and hit submit. ;)



Um. So having admitted that I'm in it for the votes -- what do we do with this?

[jacq22.livejournal.com]

Love it; 'don't consider my audience because I am my audience' I agree.

I have never had an alt. never needed one, I am who I am, but can change like the wind, have multiple personalities. We are all complex.

[theafaye.livejournal.com]

I've done lots of alts. I've never announced in advance who they are, but I've always held the principle that if anyone asked me, I'd tell them who I was. Thus far, nobody ever asked me about an alt. The issue of intersection's never come up though.

Revealing an alt can be a strategical move - if it gets a long way in the contest, revealing the true person behind it might give you an extra boost in the polls if you think you're flagging. Again, it's never really been an issue thus far.

I think the problem comes if you're using an alt to play a character. I've always treated my alts as writing exercises. On very rare occasions, they've commented in the GR/WR because their name's come up or there's a pertinent point that character can make, but for the most part, I let the writing speak for itself. I never particularly hide the fact that they're alts either if it comes up - I just don't deliberately out myself.

What I find most interesting is how differently my alts have been received to me. Often they've done better than "me" in individual polls. Lots of people last season said that they preferred a_cheese_fan's writing to my usual stuff. I really enjoy the OMG it was YOU! response when I've done a reveal but that would never matter to me more than telling people who ask. I like being read without preconceived notions or prejudice, which is the best part of an alt for me - it's a validation of my writing ability.

As far as intersection goes, assuming an alt ever got that far, I wouldn't be bothered if someone didn't want to tell me who they were. A lot of people have good reason for not using their real name on LJ, so I wouldn't expect them to tell me if they didn't want to if we partnered up. I don't need their life history to write with them.

[n3m3sis42.livejournal.com]

I posted upthread but I'm posting again because I'd love some feedback.

If anyone particularly likes or dislikes certain posts or kinds of posts that I've done, I'd love to know.

(If you particularly disliked the horrible meta post I threw up for about half an hour out of frustration on Monday because I couldn't get my real post to work, you don't need to tell me. Most of y'all probably didn't see it, though, since it was only up briefly before my very kind beta informed me that it would be a good idea to make my other post work.)

Like I said in my other comment upthread, I don't have a clear idea of who my audience is or who I want it to be. I want to connect with other parents, because being a mom is a huge part of my life right now. However, one of the reasons I signed up for LJI is that I'm working on reclaiming me, too. I am not just Max's mama; I was a person before he was born and now I'm a rather different person but there is still a "me" in there somewhere that isn't just Mommy. There are times when my first inspiration for a topic is baby-related and I end up going with something else, because I don't want this to be LJ Idol About Babies for me. :)

So, um. If anyone has thoughts or feedback based on stuff I've put out this season, I'd love to hear them.

[similiesslip.livejournal.com]

As a mom myself, I just want to say "Good for you!" I'm so glad you already see that you need to keep a little personhood. I wish I had realized that as early as you have.

Staying a person helps your children in the long run.

You're doing great. I'm sure you are also a great mother:)

Alts

[ecosopher.livejournal.com]

In a sense, everyone holds something back -- some people are more open than others but whatever you write on the page is an edited version of your life, even if it's only abridged for brevity's sake and you leave all the blood and guts in.

So I guess it shouldn't matter really whether the person you're interacting with is 'real' or not... I guess for me it's really only an issue if s/he is pretending to be someone completely different. As in, I don't mind commenting and having that person respond, that kind of interaction, but if the person has put up a comletely fabricated backstory on their user info, then it feels a little strange when I find out that the fifty-seven year old nuclear scientist from Winnepeg is really a twenty-one year old zookeeper from Reykavik.

Maybe it's my problem for making assumptions about others? It's just odd if you start talking to someone and then suddenly s/he comes out with, 'Oh, and by the way, all the stuff you thought you knew about me? Yeah... it's not true."

Then again, it's been my experience on the internets to kind of take EVERYTHING anyone says with the tinest grain of salt. I'm not saying I disbelieve everyone. I'm just saying I no longer blindly accept that people are always telling the entire truth. (See first paragraph!)

Re: Alts

[serpentpixie.livejournal.com]

'Oh, and by the way, all the stuff you thought you knew about me? Yeah... it's not true."

I've had this happen to me in Real Life. It was all kinds of messed up.

I think ... most alts here that post in the GR/WR are deception by non-information - that is, everything they say is true/their real opinion, they're just not putting it to their name for whatever reason. I think if the alt is fundamentally honest in this sense then it's probably ok, but yeah, I agree, making stuff up is disturbing.

[rattsu.livejournal.com]

Alts:

Identity is fleeting on the internet. Sometimes it is just nice to step into someone else's shoes for a while and see how people react. I've done it in the past, not here but on other sites. Have been two different people with two different lives, and very few people knew the truth. Only like two. It was fun, but it nearly ended in disaster when the girlfriend of my friend started crushing on my male account. So I had to break it off before things turned worse.

Thing is, if it is not done with malicious intent I don't give a damn. I take people at face value online, which of course means that the line between 'real' and 'fiction' is very blurred for me as well. How do I know what is what? Most of my memories are fiction anyway, I am pretty sure other people from my past would tell a different story.

One of my friends alted for a long time... I think it was last season? Not sure. I had no idea at the time, and when it was finally revealed I went 'cool, I knew there was a reason I liked the alt person'.

But I can see why some people would feel betrayed. I'm just not that kind of person.

---

Audience:

I have wondered a lot about this. I don't write for a particular audience, I write the stories I want to tell. Who likes it or not I have no idea. Writing for a particular audience... nah, couldn't do it.

Audience

[ecosopher.livejournal.com]

Even though I set out this season to do try to stretch my writing muscles, I'm still conscious of writing for an audience - I mean, you have to be, otherwise your journal would be set to private, right?

And your question got me thinking, Gary. There is a small, core group of LJ friends for whom I write. It's their comments and feedback I value, and whose usernames I look forward to seeing most in my inbox. Without exception, they're also some of my favourite people ever, both in Idol and IRL. It's not that I need their 'approval' as such, but I love it when I get it. It's they whom I worry about disappointing, if I don't do a good job. And because they're awesome, I know they probably have their favourites among what I write, but they also accept when I want to try something new.

Re: Audience

[unmowngrass.livejournal.com]

I agree, I want the approval of my friends list outside of Idol - because then I have crossed the "great divide" and written something that is interesting and relevant to them, despite the fact it came from a prompt. My personal feelings about the worst entries I've made in the competition are those that I wasn't able to do this with.

Um, while I'm here taking up the whole work room...

[ecosopher.livejournal.com]

I'm nearly finished my entry for this week and was wondering if anyone's up for a read and critique?

I'm about to head to bed (why yes it is only 9.15 on a Friday night, and your point is?) so just PM me with an email addy if you're interested.

Cheers,
Bec

Re: Um, while I'm here taking up the whole work room...

[barrelofrain.livejournal.com]

I'm happy to, Bec. You've got my email still, yeah? Send it on over!

[poppetawoppet.livejournal.com]

I pretty much agree with all the alt talk, I'm just struggling with how much the topic is in my real life, but I don't want to write an entry like everyone else's either, damn it.

[imafarmgirl.livejournal.com]

I prefer to know who alt journals are.

[tigrkittn.livejournal.com]

I'm weirded out by alts, but I have issues about being "taken in" by deception of any kind, even if it's not intended maliciously.

[medleymisty.livejournal.com]

I'm white, straight, and cis, but I'm at most upper working class and I have an associate's degree from a community college.

You do write beautifully. I'll help raise up your self-esteem any time. :)

[medleymisty.livejournal.com]

I could never do an alt. Sometimes I'll try to make up a new username and join a forum. If I do post, my first post will say "Hi, really I'm MedleyMisty!" And then I tend to not post anymore, because the new username feels weird.

I've been MedleyMisty everywhere on the net for years. It's as familiar to me as Stacy, my real name. I am who I am, and I can't be anyone else.

I don't really care if other people have alts as long as they didn't make up a whole back story and interact a lot and get people all emotionally invested.

As for writing for an audience - lol. :)

I just write what I want to write. I've gotten enough feedback on my writing over the course of my life to know it's fairly decent and that some people like reading it. And while I love that feedback and I love the people who like my writing and they do encourage me and keep me going, I really do write for myself.

That's why I prefer sharing my stuff online to trying for commercial publishing. I don't want to deal with the "market" and with what agents and editors want and what some publishing company executive thinks will sell. I just want to share myself with the world.

So I write what I feel and know and love, and put it out there. Hopefully other people will like it, but if not, oh well.

I have in my time gotten some serious haters who feel a need to tell the whole Sims community that they don't like my writing and who voraciously read everything I write just so they can make anonymous secrets about how much they hate it. That makes me proud. ;)

[not-hothead-yet.livejournal.com]

Audience

It really depends what the goal of the writing is. If I'm writing a diary-type entry about something that happened to me, I tend to write as factually and succinctly as possible so I can get to the main conclusion which is usually something I learned or what to understand. In both cases I assume my audience is my friends who know me reasonably well and know how I think. Thus I don't have to detail out everything I think and feel as such; they know how I get where I am.

But if I'm writing something for pure entertainment, I have many different approaches (delineated by specific tags) and therefore the assumption is different audiences will enjoy. I've had strangers comment on my Kid Tales and my Visual Snippets because they've been cross-posted and they are written with the notion that my audience is people who don't know me.

When i write my rants, I tend to assume my audience is people who of like mind, they will join the rant, or add something to it, perhaps giving me a new perspective. They don't have to know me well, but they do have to have some connection to the subject matter; I don't stand for people with no experience in the matter at hand lecturing to me about my POV.

More than anything, i assume my audience is much like me, educationally, knowledge-wise and worldliness. When I write a story, I try to make things more visually evocative and am more careful with my descriptions because I assume my audience to be larger and less familiar.

[whipchick.livejournal.com]

Alts - I don't know most people here well enough to be offended or bothered if they're also an alt. And the one or two people that I do know, cool, good on you for writing twice! I'd be more inclined to be impressed than irritated. Unless one of them sucked, and then I'd probably have to say, "Wow, neat writing exercise. I think I like your main style better, but go you!"

I kept an anonymous blog for two years, and it was well worth it to maintain a separate identity in order to deal with the subject matter I wanted to write frankly about. I used an ISP masker and alternate email accounts, and was pretty serious about keeping that life separate, including paying cash for the domain name, etc. It was a lot of work - but I also am pretty public in my "real" life, and I interact with children, in parts of the country that are religiously and politically very different from the opinions I wanted to express.

So yeah - a writer absolutely should create another identity if it suits them to do so! Currer, Ellis and Acton Bell, anyone?



Audience - On purpose, I'm writing for educated people who like words. Accidentally, I'm probably writing for white literary people in their 20's-40's, because that's where my experiences come from, and unless I do a ton of research, I write in the voice of a white, middle-class, literary-minded person. I'm deliberately trying to expand my cultural awareness in my writing - when it serves the plot or character, or when a cool character walks into my words and I go, "Huh, I'm gonna have to do some research if I want to write *you* well, my friend." What I love about writing what I don't know is finding things out, and I'd argue that writers must above all be curious about the world in order to write well.

I'm loving--LOVING--having to write in a slightly calculating fashion and keep votes in mind. I find that if there are no creative boundaries, I just don't f*cking sit down to make words. But the process of, "Hmm, last week was sad, better funny it up this week/last week was fiction, go for something real/is this going to open hard enough to hook a reader on entry 110/close strong enough to make someone want to vote, even if we're close in the polls?" really pushes me as a writer.

In the long run, I love writing, but I also love that writing makes money, and generating votes is good practice for generating money. Would I still write for just me? Sure, I've kept a journal all my life. But making money at it lets me move beyond recording for myself (a totally valid goal, just not mine) and spend more time working on getting better, time that I personally wouldn't be able to spend if it was always unpaid.

[snack-size.livejournal.com]

I find the idea of writing for votes to be a very good exercise, since I don't necessarily know who the audience is though I have a feel for what they like and dislike - much like the audience out there in venues where they pay for writing...

Still, I generally think more about "voice" rather than audience...I've worked to develop a pov, both in terms of my fiction and nonfiction. It is interesting to think about where these intersect and overlap - sort of a causation/correlation type debate, as in, to what extent is my voice related to, or a response to, this audience? And how has that audience influenced development?

(hopefully this was a coherent response, since I am writing one-handed and on painkillers...)